Wheels within wheels.

[Eric the Green]

(07-13-2019, 02:04 PM)Bill the Piper Wrote:

(07-13-2019, 12:49 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: Bill the Piper added a "counter-cultural" category to the mix, to make it five.

Now I've "converted" to spiral dynamics you see

Nolan chart is basically libertarian propaganda. It only sees things from the POV of Yellow capitalist meme. It measures the amount of government intervention, of interference in "natural" market dynamics. It cannot distinguish between an Islamist state banning porn because it's against the will of "Allah" (Blue theocratic meme) and a progressive government banning it because it's demeaning to women (Purple countercultural meme). Or between taxes spent on the military (Brown imperialist meme) and taxes spent on welfare programs (Red socialist meme).

Actually, the Nolan chart, although created by a libertarian, is as I explained simply the same political compass, which was created by European leftists. It doesn't matter who created the map. What Nolan did is not much more than switching the location of the axes and quadrants around. Libertarians are indeed only capitalists with some personal freedoms added along with labeling of free enterprise as freedom. But that doesn't mean they changed the political compass. They only used it because it makes a place for them.

The Nolan chart up and down axis is the measure of state control, with Libertarians near the top and statists at the bottom. This axis is exactly equal to the upper left (statist) to the lower right (libertarian) corners on the political compass. It is always amazing to me how hard it is to explain this simple fact.

The Islamic state banning porn is shown in the Nolan chart by the opposing upper left and lower right quadrants. That is the "personal freedom" that Libertarians advocate opposed to the social conservatives who want to regulate our personal lives, and impose their religion or their racial theories on us. On the political compass, this axis is the up and down axis, with the social and personal banning and regulating authority of the state at the top and the social and personal libertarians at the bottom.

If a progressive government bans porn to support women's rights, then that government is going below the horizon of the left side of the Nolan chart, or going higher in the green quadrant of the political compass, getting closer to where the Pope is above the horizon, because there is more state authority used.

The charts are inclusive of many gradations. That's why it works for anyone. And everyone is a mix of the polarities; no-one is a perfect specimen. Even I am not fully in the lower left quadrant of the compass, or the extreme left side of the Nolan chart.

The difference between taxes for the military and taxes for social welfare is quite simply the difference between the lower left and the lower right on the Nolan chart, which would go across from the left side to the top on the political compass. Militarism is social conservative, and welfare programs are socialism. But such programs are usually created by democratic socialism, so social welfare programs are close to the left on the Nolan chart, and to the lower left on the compass. Counter-culturalists, as I said, are still usually supportive of democratic socialism (the democratic side of revolution #2, what we call liberalism in the Democratic Party today).

Remember both counter-cultural leftists and libertarians are anti-war. They agree on the ground of social and personal freedom, and disagree across the axis of economic control and economic freedom. Anti-war falls in the personal freedom quadrant at the upper left of the Nolan chart, and militarism falls in the opposite social authoritarian quadrant on the lower right. Social conservatives enforce religion, race and national barriers by police, or by force of arms. They want to make their country great again, including its religious or mythological authoritarian underpinnings, and its racial purity. That is why the immoral Mr. Trump does their bidding. And if left unfettered, they will conquer other nations to create this uniformity of control by their group over others. Neo-cons naturally fall in this group, perhaps to a more moderate degree. Being more isolationist, Trump is more moderate than Hitler on this scale. But if push comes to shove, he will push the national power of the US military to its full extent and severity. Social conservatives support the righteous traditional authority trio of God (religions) family (race) and country (nation).

You may want to suppose that there are five neat corners into which people fall perfectly. But you are finding I am sure that there's not only gradations, but people might be a mix of different opposing quadrants. So a chart won't be correct if it tries to pigeonhole people into corners, but must be interpreted as a mix of the polarities accounting for one's placement nearer or farther from the center. One can have the same score if you are nearer to the center, and still disagree on some issues.